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Ahh, very good question.
Of course, to be fair, above, below and beside are rather vague and imprecise terms when it comes to planes.
In fact, that answer which, I think was me talking, doesn’t makes a lot of sense in reference to what those appendix things say.
However, it actually makes perfect sense to me.
As to what the meat in the Astlan-Abyss sandwich is….
Well–it’s a demizone of smoke, steam, dust and mud. An elemental transitional zone.
[SPOILER]And the individuals from all three planes start intermixing in volume II[/SPOILER]
Oh…and why do Boggy and I start new demons out in caves? As Antefalken asks? Why don’t we send them to the courts?
[SPOILER]Because caves don’t cost rent! Living in the Courts costs money, renting or owning. New demons are always broke.[/SPOILER]
Oh, and going back a bit, for the record, I was hinting that Rosver might be a demon.
Demons love to argue over previous statements, documents, agreements, you name it.All in, demons are just warmer, nicer, cuddlier lawyers…
Actually, you’d be surprised how often I hear that last theory.
I hear it about every 45 seconds in fact. Not sure who is whispering it in my ear, but it does get very convincing at times.
I really have no proof that anything outside myself exists. Not even sure I need anything outside myself, after all, if you are all just figments of my imagination, then I am great company for myself!
Well, demons aren’t really great businessmen, and they all have a grass is always greener on the other street sort of view.
Which is odd, because green grass doesn’t grow very well in the Abyss….
They don’t move that often, I would say most stores move maybe once a year or so, they usually go through some appearance rotations more often than moving.
I know you don’t mind it and are just pointing it out. That’s important because it causes thought and introspection and cleans things up.
It’s the sort of examination and pointing out that is critical in a Beta Reader for example.
You know, come to think of it, it’s interesting we are talking about collapsed buildings right now.
For some reason this seems to be the time of year most of the collapsed buildings start appearing!
Not sure why this season. Admittedly this is the time of year when demons and their extended families get together to drink Devil’s Nogg and feast on Roast Elf and reindeer.
Some of the “discussions” get a bit heated with the Nogg….
I suppose the ruins could be related to holiday gathering.
o:)
No idea what that means, I’ve reread and I think it represents a crossed meaning between posts.
You were making the point about why would some go to so much work to create shapeshifting buildings, and have one “shape” be a collapsed ruin…because it wouldn’t serve one’s vanity.
People build palaces out of vanity, not ruins.
And Madfoxii was countering with the point, demons like to destroy things, in particular, nice things. So building nice buildings only to subsequently destroy them is not necessarily against one’s vanity.
I.e. one can imagine a demon so vane that they want people to know they have so much power, they can afford to destroy their own palaces…
I think….
That’s an interesting question.
I don’t know about their holidays too much. Antefalken probably does. The big one in Astlan is Festival, or Leap Day and that’s an extra day that is added to the Calendar every 5 years. Everyone celebrates that, huge fairs and carnivals etc.
Of course Wylan would know about Keeper’s Day and other Oorstemothian Holidays.
In the Abyss, we celebrate Festivus, of course, but then that’s multi-dimensional, I think most every non-christian celebrates that, it is, after all, for the rest of us. I always enjoy the airing of the grievances the best. It takes me a couple days, but it’s worth it…not sure that anyone in Astlan celebrates it though.
Lillith always throws a party celebrating the day her ex and his second wife got kicked out of their garden home. There’s bobbing for apples and everyone gets a pet snake.
Each religion has a set of Holy Days as well. I’m afraid to ask the TunaCan, as the Incubus calls him. He would know all the Etonian holidays.
Most groups also celebrate seasonal holidays such as the solstice and equinox. But I’ll let the others fill you in on the Astlanian holidays…
Oh…don’t forget All Hallows Eve…that’s like a solstice, but it’s when the barriers between the planes are at their weakest. I think it’s a big overlap or something. It’s the easiest night to summon demons, or resurrect/reincarnate or just speak with the dead.
Plus there are usually holidays during the Ropian eclipses and similar events.
Ahh, yes, you all caught the slip up in the demon Rosver’s argument! As a demon, I am an expert and looking for slip ups in arguments, as is, naturally: Rosver (hint hint as to Rosver’s species)
[quote]the author is blatantly ignoring physics.[/quote]
He hadn’t better be ignoring the laws of physics, that’s my job! Where’s my union rep!
However very precisely, as Iume, Madfoxiii have pointed out, if he’s violating the laws of physics, which laws of physics is he violating?
Having traveled the Planes of Men, I can attest that the laws of physics vary greatly between them. The Outer Planes are far worse.
The Outer Planes are pretty much exclusively whatever their owner(s) wants it to be. Or so I am told.
The Planes of Men are all pretty fixed and have their own laws, their laws vary in some sort of logical order, based on where they are relative to each other. I don’t know the mapping.What I do know is that the REASON that Astlanian’s can’t get directly to Earth and why they see Earthlings as demons is because the laws of physics are too different.
That is actually what the back of the book implies and what I and Boggy explain to Tom.
So between Astlan and Earth, the laws of physics are sufficiently different that magic works, technology, not so much/it’s unreliable (gunpowder is very dangerous) much like magic is on Earth.
As to the Abyss. It is just weird. It is not in the Planes of Men as we know it, it is not one of the Outer Planes as we know them, or if it is, we don’t know who “owns it” and thus who is “Paying the mana cost to maintain it”
That’s pretty much the key with the Outer Planes, to keep them stable, a tremendous amount of Animus and Mana is required (which is why few gods have their own dedicated plane–pantheons share).The Abyss also has relatively easy access to various Planes of Men that Astlan does not. In particular, the Abyss doesn’t seem to care about the physics of various Planes of Men.
Nor, for that matter do most of the Outer Planes–I assume, since Gods get to planes with different physics somehow.
Stuff that I know the origins of, and where it comes from is “borrowed” from other planes and rigged by the owner to work in the Abyss, somehow.
All I have is my pipe, and my funky furniture, which even Rosver must admit, doesn’t take a lot of effort to work in the Abyss.I can’t account for everything in the Abyss, so maybe some of it is shaped energy. Particularly if it’s owned by a Demon Prince…
I should also note, back to atmospheric pressure. The examples I use are for Earth and Astlan (where air pressure does vary by altitude). Not clear this is true in the Abyss.
Again, not clear that the Abyss is a planet, if it is, it’s gotta be about the size of Jupiter or larger….talk about physics and gravity issues!I will note however, altitude based air pressure is discussed/important in Books 2 and onward as you will all eventually learn.
Actually, for that matter, so is everything in this current discussions (at least thematically–not detail wise–but the questions discussed)[color=red]Technically, all requests should be signed in blood, or on the internet in red ink. But I’ll take this request anyway.[/color]o:)
OOOOHHHH!!!
I love those spoiler buttons, I didn’t know you could do that!
That’s impossible! You are breaking the laws of forum!
=d>
Great long post. I have to come back to it and read it in detail, those buttons mean it is a LOT longer than I thought.
I will get back to this tonight when I can read it in detail. Can’t wait!
Tizzy!
How old am I that the expression “Looking at the world through rose colored glasses” has lost it’s meaning.
Rose Colored Glasses are used, not to reveal truth, but rather to show you the world as you want it to be.
Hence their popularity with TV and New Pundits and Bloggers. Oh and of course comment trolls….
How else can you explain all these different people with different sets of “facts” about the same world?
RCG my friends, RCG.
And yes, higher level demons can hide themselves from lower demons, and sometimes those of the same order/level.
Although to do this, you need to be able to shapechange…otherwise, horns, batwings and a tail are generally a dead give away.
