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I think it’s used once or twice by Gastrope’
It is definitely in the appendices about the moons and such.
My problem is I get so used to something, I sort of assume I must have spelled it out before…I am going to run a check and see what I can do to clear this up early on.
Yeah or just have someone point to the sun.
Actually, when they go to the grove, I think it should be pretty obvious because they are all over Fierd there. But this reference comes way too soon.
Yeah, been thinking about that. The “slow” part is that for the last month, I had the cut where it was, so was sort of working in my head and notes for the build to big end to 3.
This was my problem for sometime with Book II. Because it’s a second book, it is by its nature a “link book”
From a trilogy point of view, almost all book 2’s are the low points.
So I need to think about more climactic scenes that I can move in. Your suggestions are actually stuff I did play with, but are still less climactic than I’d ideally envision.
Here are some problems:
1) Oorstemoth and the Rod are going to head into the Abyss, demon hunting. Obviously there is a lot of ground to cover there and nothing too fast that I see.
2) The Asmeth stuff probably wouldn’t be fully realized conflict wise until book 4 as is.One thing that does happen early in book 3 is that Damien, Vaselle, and the Shamans all have to get home somehow. The experienced shamans aren’t that big of a problem because with effort they can find their homes astrally and help setup a gate point there.
The Astlanian’s are a different issue. However, Tizzy has a link to Gastrope’ so the plan is to freak the crap out of Gastrope’ with the orc shamans and others coming home via him in Murgatroy.
A big part of the Jenn/Gastrope/Grove story line (but not all of it) is to bring in the elves who are HUGE Orcus haters, to the point of being irrational (for elves–normally perturbed for everyone else)
If not clear, Aodh the third conspirator to kill Orcus is the chief avatar of Ne’t the Elvish god of war. So for this mix it is elves vs orcs.
So the point of this is that Gastrope’ sort of gets stuck as a double agent.
The question is? Is ‘the return trip’ big enough? Not clear.
Also, I don’t have to cut stuff to fit this particular thing in. If I had to I could up the page numbers by quite a bit and make the book at least 1/3 bigger.
However, just stuffing things might not be the answer. Sometimes less is more if it speeds up the story.
So, even if not necessary, cutting might be useful.
Also, would more Tom early on be useful?
The problem is, they are in the cave recuperating and bored. Boredom is an important contrast. So I’m not sure what Tom would be doing other than his mental anxiety gymnastics and arguing with Talarius.
Arguing with Talarius could be amusing though.
The planet rotates and orbits Fierd and tilts….the plane either doesn’t or is synched with abyss.
Actually it isn’t necessarily a problem for most people (that can do it). It only is for Tom because the only way he’s ever done it was by following a link. I.e. he needs practice
The archdemons pop in and out from wherever they want to.
In many ways it’s much like teleportation, you really have to know where you want to go.
There are people and things in Book II that are setups for later books.
Some are obvious, some may not be. So I thought I’d talk about those in this topic.
These are just details that influence why stuff is. However, the more important point is how their inclusion in this book affected your impression of the storyline.
————————–
The Asmeth Plotline:
[SPOILER]
In case it wasn’t obvious, the 3 passengers on Captain Asmeth’s boat are 3 of the inter-dimensional brigands described by Trisfelt, and they are fleeing Oorstemoth.They are three of the people hired by Lenamare to steal the book from Oorstemoth and who Lenamare left out to dry in prison.
They are escaped prisoners of Oorstemoth. Hunted by Oorstemoth. They are pissed at Lenamare. So they are antagonistic to Oorstemoth and Lenamare.
They are traveling down to the southern continents to meet up with two other culprits, one is a very odd wizard called the Mobius Magi (who is not your normal mage) and the other is Asfrid and she’s been dead for many centuries now, but is still going strong.
[/SPOILER]——————————–
The Djinn
[SPOILER]
The Djinn are allies of Turelane and enemies of Exador. They were also allies of Orcus and don’t like Lilith. They also don’t like the Etonians and refer to them as false gods (technically though, all gods but their god are false gods)They will be allies of Tom against Exador and Tiernon.
This gets interesting because Randolf is trying to capture/imprison/kill Exador, even though he technically is Exador’s sycophant. He does this to keep his people safe, avoiding the fate of Abancia that Exador basically obliterated.
Turelane has a very long history with the Djinn and each ruler since its founding (and before) has been an anchor for a djinn in the material world.
[/SPOILER]Phaestus/Hephaestus/Vulcan & Völund
[SPOILER]Actually, Tamarin calling Phaestus Vulcan was not supposed to be a reveal.
He introduced himself to Reggie as Hephaestus, which is the Greek Nname for Vulcan. Reggie just didn’t know that, and he still doesn’t get the Vulcan reference.
Also, recall that Hephaestus was mentioned in the Grove by Duranor, the dwarven Geomancer Elder of the Grove.
Hephaestus is also known as pêTah a member of the Nyjyr Ennead. He is one of the few of that pantheon with worshipers in the localverse
So Phaestus=Hephastus=Vulcan=pêTah is an ancient Greek, Roman and Egyptian god. He helped build both Tartarus and Mount Doom.
He is a very interesting character in that he is on good terms with Mount Doom and the djinn, and is a god of the dwarves, which means he doesn’t get along with Elves. He is also a member of the Nyyer Ennead so that means he works with Bess and the rest.
Völund is the nordic name for Wayland the Smith, a quasi-nordic deity/jotunn. Known to sleep with valkyries. Mythic-ally, he plays a role very similar to Hephaestus in European mythology. Here, they are two people that are friends.
Völund is more a smith an engineer, Hephaestus is a craftsman/smith/artisan/engineer.
Völund is who is believed to have forged Excalibur along with many other blades and weapons.
He ties out to the jotun’s and the norse deities
He also helped build Mount Doom. He has lived there for several thousand years, but does on occasion leave
[/SPOILER]
——————————————-
The Nyjyr Ennead (Bess and friends)
[SPOILER]
Bess, if not obvious by now, is the Egyptian goddess [url=https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bastet]Bastet[/url]
The Nyjyr Ennead are basically the old gods of Egypt. They are down on their luck, first the demiurge began kicking their butts under the rule of the Pharoah Ramses and then by Christianity and Islam on Earth. On other planes it was the Etonians that came after them.
They were basically driven out of the localverse and pretty much everywhere.
They stopped wasting mana on having a set of Outer Planes and moved to Uropia the closer moon of Astlan. They are tryig to stage a comeback.
They are running several games trying to get their revenge on the Etonians and reclaim their rightful glory.
Ramses the Damned (the guy who’s army was swallowed in the Red Sea) moved to the Abyss upon death. He did an Exador thing with the Anilords pretending to be human for sometime. All the Ramses are him, and he is an archdemon.
Ramses never really believed in the Egyptian gods and so has no clue that Bess is Bastet, although she knows who he is.
She teamed with Ramses and Exador to get the book, which she then intended to steal from them, because gods outrank archdemons (in theory)
[/SPOILER]
More in a later post.
Cool. I had been going to go more into paranoia on their part.
However, the only think I would need to check is that it shows the arrival of the knights, I think. Or maybe that’s a different chapter than this.
I do want to demonstrate the Gaius was not in the camp when Gadius was there. And very specifically that he just “shows” up in Keeper’s City.
Introduction to the Grove, establish age of Trevyn, Dwarf-vs-Elf animosity, introduction to the Prince and less important Elraith.
Also back discussion on Orcus and the Nyjyr Ennead.
Yeah, azw3 is what I was messing with. Ick.
I have put the epub out there. Had to zip it up because webserver doesn’t like epub extension and I’m betting many browsers/fw will have issues.
OK, will try a few.
Once on your computer, be sure and try what I send you on device. May take a couple tries.
Trying epub first.Yeah the dates depend on the calendar. People skipped/were bored by the calendar/moons/astrology appendices and such (OK, all the technical stuff). Perhaps a re-emphasos on the history/timeline in appendix.
Not sure what 18% is. Chapter/Scene makes more sense to me.
[SPOILER]First…sort of half is reactions of others….second half is Tom….problem is, right now he is stuck in a cave while other stuff happens…this [SPOILER] is a purposeful reminder for later when [SPOILER]things get crazy for him[/SPOILER][/SPOILER][/SPOILER]
But I take your point. If Tom is the core protagonist (and he is) there needs to be more him. Was talking WoT before with many. Biggest annoyance with WoT was not enough Rand…who gave a crap about most of the other crazy people and their cults etc.
As an author, and this is different from my perspective as a reader/fan (WoT above) as an author I judge on comments and reactions I get from people. Oddly when it came to specifics I got quite a bit of commentary on other characters and others reactions, less on Tom. The problem as with anything governance/help desk/issues at work. [b] Squeaky wheels get heard.[/b] Things people like are assumed. So when I hear…”I want more of this/that” that gets heard above the silence of those who like where things are.
Your point is interesting but I can’t discuss it more until you get further along….it also plays into bigger considerations I have for the series which is something I want to discuss with Beta Demons who’ve read the book. The goal is going to be to balance long term needs to set the stage vs short term satisfaction. This is something I struggle with and need advice on. I call it “Second Bookitus” Second books (starting with Trilogies…but still true today) are always “bridge novels” the question is, by the end, do readers get enough meat to keep them around for book III?
Hmm,
Interesting. I get the point, when you say Card are you saying Orson Scott Card (Ender’s Game) to make sure. Not that I can think of anyone else, but I haven’t read anything of his in well 20+ years. BTW ‘A Planet Call Treason’ was my favorite work of his. I think I read it like 6 or 7 times. “Ender’s Game” of movie fame was good. (2+ reads)
Thanks. You are both adding to my own fears ( =d> ) Seriously. I have had such thoughts. Not sure what to do yet…so looking for more thoughts.
So far, excited by results/comments! All technically good, if not wish fulfillment! 8-[ But still very happy. Need this.
Maybe Alpha Demons should be next. Not sure how many could be that brave…but really only need a few.
THX!
OK, was thinking 92.1 was % and I’m like damn…speed reader…92.1 is scene…ok…totally gone…been eating too many cookies I guess.
[SPOILER]But, getting “cookied” comes much late than Chapter 92.1[/SPOILER]
