Arad’s Plane of the Thirst for Knowledge

[Tizzy]

I would have to believe such insecurities would be in his mind.

Now, I don’t know, but given his rather “goody good” attitude, my bet is that Tom is a virgin.

Now one could argue that a demoness is not the place for a virgin to start, but given that size issue and the shapeshifting concern, that would mean that a proportionately sized demoness would make the most sense for a first time. However, even a human sized demoness would be better for Edwyrd because if things suddenly double or more in size it wouldn’t kill the demoness.

I have to suspect that killing your first sex partner by sudden expansion would be traumatic and might leave one with severe emotional issues.

Unless one started with severe emotional issues to begin with.

[Tizzy]

🙂

Well, yes, he’s fathered a lot of offspring, but not that frequently. He’s pretty old. I’ve known him for a very very very long time.

Well, I can’t answer the vulnerability of the clothes without giving away explicit information that will appear (if you are observant) in book 2.

So it’s more like the reason he wears clothes in the first place is in Tales of the Demon Bard. Why clothes don’t burn will be possibly more obvious in book 2, at least for those wearing clothes in the abyss; and you will note there aren’t that many.

There are hints about his history on the map, and in the timeline.

[Rosver]

And why do you let the view of others define who you are? You must be insane because others think so? You are worthless because others think so?

Or is it becuase demons are maleable to human thoughts? That prove my theory.

[quote=Tizzy;1689]So while Antfalken does sleep around, and has fathered children it doesn’t happen that much, and Antefalken is also sort of a special case, he’s got some special experience in mortal/demon back and forth that very few demons have. I suspect that makes him more fertile than most. This is something that will be told in Tales of the Demon Bard…some day. It may also help explain his clothes…and why he wears them, why they don’t burn or dry out.[/quote]

Well, that is not how I read it. Antefalken had said that he lost count of the number of his offsprings. That only happens when the number is quite big enough to lost count of.

And how would that explain the invulnerability of his clothes? That doesn’t make any sense.

[Rosver]

For me, I say… who needs sex?

It just seems stupid that Demons are busy trying to make babies when they don’t need to.

But then, Rupert would not have existed. So maybe there is a positive side to this sex thing.

There is also the problem of Tom’s children being half demons. That would be especially difficult to those children as exemplified by Rupert. Rupert already expressed his desire to end his life. Well that would not be a problem, I think, if Tom behave like Antefalken, not caring about his offsprings and all. His children could kill themselves for all he cares.

@Tizzy

You don’t have to be so graphic you know?

[Rosver]

@MadfoxII

My point. Who need sex?

The demons just really has no need for it. Sex is developed for procreation (because we die, and not procreating means death of the species) which demons just don’t need at all. I always find it quite ridiculous that creatures that are beyond the limitation of mortals still requires such mortal necessity as sex. You have here creatures who don’t need to eat, don’t need to drink, could not sleep nor need to, never have to excrete, and find breathing a hindrance; who are immortals and lived for eternity… but they need sex? Bullshit!… well almost. It just sounds so absurd to me.

@Tizzy

There are gold and platinum in the Abyss?

Though, why not? As Tom had experienced, modesty seems to be non existent in demons.

And where did you get that strange image. It looks so old fashioned.

Thank god we won’t have ghost sex and such. Ridiculous!

[Tizzy]

RE: Antefalken’s clothes.

I think you misunderstand me, demons that wear clothes (or the vast majority of them) wear clothes everywhere in the Abyss, not just in the courts, how they do that is not based on temperature. You will see what I mean in book ii, if you pay attention, and I know from experience, you do. 🙂

Do you really think Lillith is going to tour her gold and platinum mines naked?

Have you ever seen Asmodeus when he wasn’t impeccably dressed?
[albumimg]10[/albumimg]

RE: Sex drive

Most Astlanians assume that demons are sex starve fiends who want to rape, ravage and pillage, particularly young maidens and princesses, so their bodies come with the equipment to do so (also see the question of # female demons there are)

But, Madfoxii is correct, the bodies are not truly detailed internally anatomically correct. Tom notices this with the dragon, and is concerned about it when eating food as a human, in particular, will he be able to process it.

As a rule, things “work as needed” So if the demon and those who summoned him thinks he’s a hormone driven monster, than he is…otherwise not.

You will note that a lot of the lesser demons aren’t particularly sex starved. I mean who ever heard of a sex starved Shadow.

There are, however, some sex starved imps, but I again think that’s more do to their impish nature and they do it to freak out mortals etc.

[Madfox11]

Considering Tom doesn’t have a body anymore, or at least not a body in the biological meaning of the word, there is no reason to assume he still has to go through/is in puberty. Do demons even have hormones? In fact, considering the lack of drive for procreation amongst demons, it wouldn’t surprise me most demons have no sex drive at all. What need does an energy based being has for that except as a tool to manipulate physical beings perhaps? I also find it unlikely that demons can accidentally have kids. I would expect that magical based creatures need to make a conscious decision to impregnate a physical being. That is based on my admittedly rather limited experience with demons and other spiritual beings, so I might be wrong.

As for Antefalken not remembering how many kids he has, even with just a few kids, if you as a father really don’t care, let alone stick around for months to watch the results, you are bound to loose track. The fact that he has centuries just adds to that. Note that he does say that most half-demonic kids are actually normal mortals with at best a weird trait or two. Only very powerful demons tend to generate demonic kids with portals. So Rupert’s situation seem to be rather rare.

[Rosver]

But Tizzy Antefalken is wearing his clothes outside the Courts. When he meet Tom and Rupert the first time outside Tom’s cave, Antefalken is clothed.

And of course the bevarages, espcially wine and other alcoholic ones. There was one scene where you and Boggy carried a bottle of wine to Tom’s cave, and of course there is also Antefalken walking all over Abyss with a bottle of wine.

A deck of cards should not be a problem. There are heat resistant plastic, paint and inks.

[Tizzy]

Yes.

But again the Courts are Cooler, and the palace and buildings even more so.

Plus, as you will learn in volume II we do trade with worlds where conditions are similarly nasty so we can get materials from those worlds, and those may look like Earth items, but actually be different materials.

I think the key thing to realize is that there is not a single answer for every demon/situation. As I’ve said, things in the Abyss are pretty hodge podge, a demon finds something that works for them to accomplish a purpose and they stick with it. Two different demons may achieve the same ends by completely different means, which is why I can’t tell you every single case/possibility.

I know you are going to be very disturbed by the deck of cards that Antefalken, Talarius, Boggy and Estrebrius are using to play Whist (and the marker as well).

[Tizzy]

I’m a demon, I am very demographic!

The main reason demons need to be interested in sex from an Astlanian point of view is that Lust/Carnality is a sin, and therefore, since demons are the epitome of sin and the vile nature of mankind, demons must be into lust and gluttony and all such sins.

Actually, I think most Astlanian’s would be disappointed to find out that demons really don’t have that much sex. Certainly no more than humans on average.

Actually, it’s not particularly easy for a demon to impregnate a mortal. This is another reason they use incubae and succubae, they are built for this sort of thing and change change demon essence into something compatible with humans.

So while Antfalken does sleep around, and has fathered children it doesn’t happen that much, and Antefalken is also sort of a special case, he’s got some special experience in mortal/demon back and forth that very few demons have. I suspect that makes him more fertile than most. This is something that will be told in Tales of the Demon Bard…some day. It may also help explain his clothes…and why he wears them, why they don’t burn or dry out.

[The Author Guy]

Rosver in regards to Antefalken you say:

[quote]Well, he is 700 years old. Still that does not illiminate the problem of the half demon parency and the pain it would cause.[/quote]

Do you remember where this is? or if you surmise, what led you to this? While it sounds reasonable, I can’t figure out where this is written and I need to pindown some dates and times.

Thanks

[Tizzy]

Oh and FYI, that’s a picture of Asmodeus from ADD Monster Manual (original, first edition)

That’s how famous he is! They’ve even heard of him in Greyhawk!

[Tizzy]

I am sure there is some YAD author out there writing teen ghost story romances along the lines of Twiglight and all the rest.

I mean if you can make vampires sparkle and werewolves cuddly and lovable, why not ghost sex.

I think you are missing the point. Demons are people too, and most/many were people. Sex is not just about procreation, it’s also about intimacy and sharing between two (or more) people–and it’s pleasurable and fun and all sorts of things.

So those demons that can, are going to want to have pleasure and share pleasure (and pain—lots of S&M, B&D down here)

We experience pain, why not pleasure? You do know that it’s a fine line between pleasure and pain. If you can experience pain, then you can experience pleasure.

They are the carrot and the stick.

It’s the masochist who is able to mix the two and turn pain into pleasure.

Pain, suffering torment, these are the core fundamentals of demon life.

Thus, the opposites of these must be equally core, so things that cause pleasure: SEX, booze, drugs, rock and roll (music) these must also be integral to demonic existence.

[The Author Guy]

I am not sure I get your distinction between medieval world and fantasy world.

Middle Earth is a fantasy world and it’s based on medieval earth…most fantasy worlds are.

What I’m saying is that I’m basing it on fantasy worlds based on already inaccurate medieval worlds or something to that affect.

1) There is another bard showing up in book ii, technically he was in Book 0–the story that happened before this book, before Tom showed up. He was in prison in Oorstemoth until recently, along with some companions.
2) How do you know you haven’t met a bard will magical powers already, who just didn’t happen to use them? :-k
3) Tales of the Demon Bard will focus on all sorts of bards and related people. Bard schools etc.

I agree, bards certainly don’t have to have witnessed the events; some do, but I would guess that a lot are taken either from rehashing other stories/songs and or from reading what actual sages have written. But I am pretty sure a big part is plagiarism from other bards….

[Rosver]

Wow! Your concept is quite exciting.

Its new though isn’t it? Not a shred of it is present in the first book. It would have been great though if it was given even just a passing nod in the first book.

“The thing you need to keep in mind, this book and Astlan is not based on the medieval world, it’s based on the stereotypical/idealized fantasy world.”

Well, that is kinda weird. With castles, keeps, knights, plate armor, Nobles (Barons), that psuedo latin, bards… I was quite sure that Astlan is heavily based on medieval world. Also stereotypical/idealized fantasy world is medieval fantasy. It is the one you see in most fantasy games and literature.

To give contrast, compare yours to Ancient Greek/Roman Mythology worlds. Or Arabian fantasy world. Or the Asian inspired world of Avatar: The Legend of Aang, the Last Air Bender.

Actually, Tizzy and I had already discussed this.

So, with all the excitement, we are going to have a Spell Singer as a character?
I kinda like the Spell Singer serries (well, the first few) and having a similar character in Astlan sounds so exciting! Lets see some Tom vs Spell Singer battle!

[Author]

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